Feminist in the US, Subservient in Syria

Unbelievable. Does this woman have any dignity at all? Well, apparently not...

#1 rightguy on 2007-04-03 16:41 (Reply)

Why aren't you complaining about the times Laura Bush donned a head scarf to enter a Mosque????????

http://thinkprogress.org/2007/04/04/pelosi-laura-bush-scarf/

#1.1 shades on 2007-04-04 09:54 (Reply)

How about a little intellectual honesty from the right wing on this one?

I'm not trying to be hostile, but none of you have replied to the many many comments on this post about Condi Rice or Laura Bush wearing a scarf in a mosque.

It's done out of respect, like wearing a yarmulke at a Bar Mitzvah, or covering your shoulders when entering a Catholic Church.

Come on, people, for goodness sake.

#1.2 coda on 2007-04-04 13:03 (Reply)

Scarf aside, Nancy Pelosi's trip to Syria was a giant step backward for American women. She has strengthened the stereotype that women are backstabbing bitches. So much for decades of women in management trying to prove otherwise...

If a manager in Corporate America blatantly disregarded the orders of upper management and publicly misrepresented the Corporation's mission, we'd all agree that the manager should be fired immediately. Correct? Why does the political arena allow such insubordination?

#1.3 Old Blue on 2007-04-05 17:37 (Reply)

That kind of "insubordination" is allowed because she's an elected leader, not an appointed leader. We choose if she stays not Bush.

#1.3.1 Alex on 2007-04-08 22:59 (Reply)

That's a bit excessive, considering Syria is a very secular state. It would be a bit like her wearing a traditional Catholic veil to wander around the Mall in D.C. on a Sunday... so pious, as to be nearly facetious.

#2 Al Maviva (Homepage) on 2007-04-03 19:48 (Reply)

She is disgusting. Wearing the rag of shame in Syria while our troops are getting killed by Syrian trained Jhadist thugs; I hope they keep her. She is a disgusting American Dhimmi, stay there Pelosi.

#3 ron nord on 2007-04-03 19:52 (Reply)

Doin' the old jane fonda...

#4 Wyostk on 2007-04-03 19:56 (Reply)

The Catholic Church isn't currently wrestling with an internal culture bent on wide-spread killing and the suppression of women either. Don't equate them.

#4.1 artboy on 2007-04-03 22:07 (Reply)

It is a simple sign of respect, to get respect, one needs to show respect.

Look into your own heart, find the love for all humanity, and please stop fearing your own shadow.

#4.1.1 Al B Tross on 2007-04-04 11:00 (Reply)

I can't believe I'm about to defend Nancy Pelosi, but I am. Look, I'm not a Catholic, but I'd still take my hat off before entering a Catholic church and my wife would cover her head. Nor am I a Buddhist, but I'd take my shoes off before entering one of their temples. I think that most Americans would do the same. Not because we agree with the tenets of the Catholic church or Buddhisim, but out of respect for the beliefs of those who are Catholic or Buddhist. I don't see that there is anything wrong with Pelosi covering her head before entering a mosque for similar reasons.

Now, I think Pelosi is wrong to be in Syria -- it's not the Speaker's job to conduct foreign policy -- and we can criticize her for that, but not for covering her head. That's just being polite.

#5 David Walser on 2007-04-03 19:58 (Reply)

"Politeness" has rarely been an observed trait in the modern Left.

#5.1 Matt Hooper on 2007-04-03 20:12 (Reply)

In both instances that you've cited, both men and women are expected to remove their hats and shoes, respectively. Conversely, when I lived in Boston, it was common for me to see women in full burkas walking with their husbands who were dressed in khaki shorts and Gap t-shirts at the Cambridge Galleria.

That's not politeness. That's oppression.

#5.2 Paul Geary (Homepage) on 2007-04-03 21:55 (Reply)

Both of your examples are examples that are not only gender-non-specific, but specific to places of worship. In such instances, such an action may show respect and humility to an ancient tradition.

Wearing a headscarf in a walkabout is not a sign of respect, it is a sign of submission to an oppressive culture. As such, it is disgraceful.

A good comparison would be to expect, nay DEMAND, that a Syrian ambassador bow his head to a Christian prayer when visiting a nation that is predominantly Christian (like the US).

#5.3 Matthias (Homepage) on 2007-04-04 01:37 (Reply)

(*Look, I'm not a Catholic, but I'd still take my hat off before entering a Catholic church and my wife would cover her head.*)

The tradition that said women had to cover their heads in a Catholic church went by the wayside ages ago, you will rarely see a woman under seventy with a hat on in a Catholic church. Even the nuns in my parish don't wear hats or scarves except for the very old. None of them wear habits any more. As far as men go, in the summer you might see a kid or two wearing a ball cap if you go to Saturday Mass, but his parents aren't happy about it. The mainstream Catholic church in the US is a pretty liberal group, with the exeption of their stance on abortion, and as you can see by listening to Mrs Pelosi, there's no danger in arguing that issue and remaining in the good graces.

There's absolutely no comparison between the Roman Catholic Church and Islam. I'd say more but at some point I'd like to visit Turkey.

#5.4 Lost My Cookies on 2007-04-04 08:22 (Reply)

Actually, some religious orders still wear habits--for example, the Dominican sisters, who have a large order in the U.S. based out of Nashville, Tennessee. "Nuns" can also be a misnomer for women in religious orders; if they are cloistered, then they are indeed nuns. However, if they aren't cloistered and are teaching, then they are sisters.

But you are absolutely right about women no longer being required to cover their heads.

#5.4.1 anonymous on 2007-04-04 09:12 (Reply)

Too bad the Iranians didn't think to require the kow-tow so Nancy could be photographed doing that, too. She can do anything she wants as a private citizen, but she is visiting a hostile nations as a representative of the US government, unfortunately.

Oriana Fallaci one of these off in a face-to-face interview with the Ayatollah Khomeini. Guts vs. grovel.

#6 Byron on 2007-04-03 20:15 (Reply)

She's wearing a frickin' abaya too. Would you ask your friends to sling on a nun's habit - even a modern one - to attend a wedding at your church? It's ostentatious groveling, before a guy who is doing everything he can to thwart our interests, keep Lebanon in subservience, and prevent an Israeli/Palestinian peace. I'm in favor of showing respect, but the abaya is really overdoing it.

#7 Al Maviva on 2007-04-03 20:18 (Reply)

You guys are so biased it's ridiculous. Whenever a diplomat travels to a foreign nation, it is respectful for them to observe local custom. And for you guys criticizing her for being there, how about criticizing Republicans Frank Wolf, Joe Pitts and Robert Aderholt for going there recently as well? Thank god that now someone who can speak coherently, and isn't looking for an excuse for war, is conducting our foreign policy. If you think its so ridiculous for Pelosi to wear the scarf, I look forward to you tearing apart President "he put on ferener clothes, so he must be stupid" Bush in this pic wearing a kimono. http://www.moveleft.com/moveleft/images/bush_goofy/bush_kimono_with_austrailian_pm.jpg

#8 Cameron on 2007-04-03 20:22 (Reply)

I don't think it's biased -- we don't like it when Sec. Rice wears one either. It's demeaning to women. End of converstaion.

And frankly, I think the Repubs who went to Syria have less reason to have gone there than Pelosi, who is after all the Speaker.

But where I differ hugely with you is the notion that Pelosi should be "conducting" our foreign policy. if she goes anywhere, she should not be enunciating a different policy than the Administration -- and that goes for the repub who would do it to the Dem president in the future.

That's just foolish and fraught with danger, not only for Bush, but for future presidents as well.

And frankly, your comparison between Bush wearing ceremonial Japanese clothing and Speaker Pelosi or Condi Rice wearing a headscarf is too ridiculous for words.

#8.1 Tom Elia on 2007-04-03 20:33 (Reply)

And by the way, Nancy Pelosi can "speak coherently"?

In what language?

#8.2 Tom Elia on 2007-04-03 20:37 (Reply)

Cameron, is or is not the head scarf one of the ways feminists have claimed that women are demeaned and oppressed by the religion of islam and the institutions in middle east countries?

and is Pelosi a principled feminist?

fair question. More to do about personal convictions, than diplomacy with fereners. Lift your BDS blinders fer a sec.

#8.3 boomdude on 2007-04-03 20:42 (Reply)

If one is to follow local customs, how is it that Muslim women in the US continue to wear the headscarf and in some cases the full black body bag? As far as I know, the local custom in the US is NOT to have women wear full body bag coverings. Apparently only Americans must do as the local custom is in other countries and then swallow those local customs when imported here in the US. Big double standard.

#8.4 fedup on 2007-04-04 10:23 (Reply)

I hate to say it but seeing Nancy in that hijab gives me a bit of schadenfruede. These pictures and this trip could haunt her for the rest of her career. Not that she probably cares.

#9 G Wiz on 2007-04-03 20:26 (Reply)

"You guys are so biased it's ridiculous. Whenever a diplomat travels to a foreign nation, it is respectful for them to observe local custom."

Yes. I remember Eleanor Roosevelt dressing in traditional Japanese Kimono out of 'respect' for their 'local customs'.

#10 RadCap on 2007-04-03 20:47 (Reply)

Here's a challenge for y'all.

Madeleine Albright visited Syria, Egypt, Saudi Arabia etc.when she served as Sec of State. I remember seeing a picture in a newspaper of one of her Saudi Arabian visits, walking with the princes and official.

I NEVER saw a picture of her with a head scarf on, even with the Saudi princes. Someone see if you can dfins a picture of her in Saudi Arabia or Syria -- (I looked on the State Dept site, nothing there).

Maybe Sec of State Albright did wear a scarf and there are no pictures. (I swear I saw her naked hear with the princes.) Maybe somebody should ask her?

Ms. Pelosi is a politically correct, anti-feminist fraud.

Some of Albright's trips: September 12, 1997
Syria
Damascus
Met with President Assad.

September 12-13, 1997
Egypt
Alexandria
Met with President Mubarak.

September 13-14, 1997
Saudi Arabia
Jeddah, Abha, Prince Sultan Air Base
Met with King Fahd and Crown Prince Abdullah, with Gulf Cooperation Council Foreign Ministers, and visited U.S. military personnel.

September 14-15, 1997
Jordan
Amman
Met with King Hussein.

September 13-14, 1997
Madeleine K. Albright
Jeddah, Abha, Prince Sultan Air Base
Met with King Fahd and Crown Prince Abdullah, with Gulf Cooperation Council Foreign Ministers, and visited U.S. military personnel.

November 16-17, 1997
Madeleine K. Albright
Riyadh
Discussed the Iraq crisis with senior Saudi officials.

February 1-2, 1998
Madeleine K. Albright
Riyadh
Discussed the Iraq crisis with Crown Prince Abdullah.

January 27-28, 1999
Madeleine K. Albright
Riyadh, Prince Sultan Air Base
Discussed the Iraq crisis with King Fahd and senior Saudi officials and addressed U.S. military personnel.

December 6-7, 1999
Madeleine K. Albright
Riyadh
Met with King Fahd and Crown Prince Abdullah.

October 17-18, 2000
Madeleine K. Albright
Riyadh
Discussed the Middle East peace process with King Fahd and senior officials; also met with Syrian President Bashar Assad.

So. Head scarf or no?

What do you think?

#11 JAL on 2007-04-03 20:57 (Reply)

Halfbright didn't wear a headscarf because she wanted those fools to see her head was too ugly to cut off.

#11.1 Vince on 2007-04-04 10:56 (Reply)

Polite? Mrs. Pelosi is not being polite. Mrs. Pelosi is being rude and malicious beyond my power to express.

Are the women of Syria required to wear the veil, and even if they were would we condone it? There are more than just fundamentalist Islamists in Syria. There are secularists. There are women who wish to be or remain free of the oppression of Islamists. There are Christians trying to maintain a tradition in Syria nearly two millenium old.

Mrs. Pelosi is putting a boot on the back of anyone in Syria that wishes to escape that oppression. She is participating in oppression as surely as if she flogged the dissidents in Syria with a rod herself. She is not respecting religious tradition. She is not demonstrating tolerance. She is empowering a group that shows no respect for other religious traditions, no tolerance, and no respect for women.

This is Mrs. Pelosi's 'Jane Fonda' momment. She might as well have been manning an anti-aircraft position, or helping build explosive belts.

#12 celebrim on 2007-04-03 21:31 (Reply)

I went back and looked at the Yahoo photos. She was in a mosque at the time of wearing the head scarf. That alters my comments somewhat above, as it wasn't during her meetings with the leadership that she wore the head scarf.

I am guessing she had to wear the abayah (robe) because her pant suit was unacceptable in the mosque also. I note in one of the pictures that one of the other women is wearing a light colored coat / jacket looking thing, inmtead of the robe.

Was she a fraud for wearing the scarf in the mosque? My guess is she couldn't get in without it, so it's a "We report, you decide" issue.

Whether she is a fraud or not, she appears to be a power suck. It still blows my mind that she went to Syria. All this will come back on her big time, and it won't be pretty. She is not dealing with Republicans in the Middle East.

#13 JAL on 2007-04-03 21:35 (Reply)

The photo nauseated me. What a dope. Is she not aware that plenty of Muslim women today do not wear the hijab? It's one of those symbols that Islamists have been pushing. Does Condi wear a hijab to attend meetings? I fervently hope not. All she is doing is lending weight to the most backward elements of the Islamic world--and taking women a huge step backwards in the process. She is a total hypocrite, espousing militant feminism at home and kneeling down to submit to Islam in this terrorist place.

#14 Susanna on 2007-04-03 22:41 (Reply)

Forget Pelosi. Why is William Shatner in Syria?

#15 E. Nough (Homepage) on 2007-04-03 23:06 (Reply)

It isn't any more hypocritical then when our president's wife wears that sh*t. http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2005/05/images/20050522-4_p44900-527-515h.html

#16 boons_orama on 2007-04-03 23:10 (Reply)

Why the f do you care so much about the oppression in other cultures? You're conservative right? Since when did we take on this "we need to change the world for the better" attitude? Let's care about America first and only.

Or at least make it equal in all the animal kingdom; and be pissed that male dogs treat bitches like, well, bitches.

Nerds.

#16.1 Cochise. on 2007-04-04 17:54 (Reply)

Your comment speaks for itself...

#16.1.1 Tom Elia on 2007-04-04 18:36 (Reply)

Most comments do. Actually, ALL comments do, that's why they're called comments!

Nerd.

#16.1.1.1 Cochise. on 2007-04-05 10:40 (Reply)

I'd just like to point out that (presumably) nobody pointed a gun at her head and forced her to enter the mosque.

She chose to do it of her own free will, and thereby chose the consequences of that action as well.

And that, therefore, is where the true charge of self-serving two-faced hypocrisy lies: she could have simply not entered the mosque, and thereby avoided wearing the 'mask of misandry'.

Because, yes, folks, that's actually what it is as well. It's not just about controlling women; it's also about reinforcing a fundamental presupposition regarding men -- that they are so animalistic, perverted, lacking in rational self-control, and so on, that women must cover themselves for self-protection from 'overexciting' them.

The burka, hajib, and so on are every bit as fundamentally offensive towards men, because of precisely that purpose behind their use.

Through her clothing, Pelosi has arguably accused all men of being rapists.

#17 Acksiom (Homepage) on 2007-04-03 23:25 (Reply)

LMAO at you. Misandry? sorry, but the violent males in these countries are the ones who force that clothing on women; not the other way around. If a woman doesn't wear it, they ARE RAPED AND KILLED. On the other hand, I guess Mrs. bush must also hate men, since she has worn the abaya herself when traveling overseas.

#18 boons_orama on 2007-04-03 23:29 (Reply)

Pelosi looks like Elaine Bennis dressed up as "Jackie Onasisisis." (Seinfeld)
All she needs are the bugaboo sunglasses.

#19 BrianNYC on 2007-04-03 23:50 (Reply)

It doesn't seem to have occurred to you that women in 'these countries' might also support and endorse those same strict sexist behavioral codes themselves. As well as the use and threat of violence to punish some and consequentially intimidate others.

Just look around any community in the usa where there is a non-trivial muslim presence -- I myself live in one, and I see women in such clothing on a daily basis. Are you claiming that those women also being forced into such clothing by 'violent males' in this country?

Are you claiming that if these women here in the usa don't wear it, they 'ARE RAPED AND KILLED' too?

And if you aren't, then isn't your supposed 'counterpoint' -- which appears to be little more than a reactionary knee-jerk regurgitation of standard femelitist non-thought -- invalid?

Not to mention how something doesn't stop being misandrous just because men are responsible for it -- just as similar things don't stop being misogynous simply because women do them.

One does not, in fact, necessarily have to be of a different gender for one's actions, words, or thoughts to be misandrous or misogynous. We all discriminate against other members of our own genders specifically because of their gender on a regular basis.

Virtually no one is willing to acknowledge this, mainly because of how gender has become a tribal marker over the past couple of generations, while less and less of our so-called 'adult' population have matured past the adolescent level of tribal self-identification -- i.e., behaving as though they're still effectively in high school.

#20 Acksiom (Homepage) on 2007-04-04 00:04 (Reply)

MEN made the laws that their Muslim women have to wear that stuff. Yes, MEN are saying they can't help raping women. You can't blame the women who are forced by religion and law to wear those things. If a woman in the U.S.A. wears one, it's probably b/c her husband will beat and kill her for not doing so. If you don't like it, why aren't you fighting against it? Join a men's rights club and go abroad teaching about it. If you don't, then you are just a snivelling whining masculitist.

#20.1 boons_orama on 2007-04-04 09:39 (Reply)

The world misses Orianna Fallaci today.

#21 johnstodder (Homepage) on 2007-04-04 01:14 (Reply)

I can't feature Hillary dressing up like that. She would give the male who suggested it to her one of these looks (http://michellemalkin.com/archives/007233.htm) and he would slink away, spending the remainder of the trip avoiding eye contact with Mrs. Clinton.
( check the link )

#22 papertiger on 2007-04-04 03:25 (Reply)

Waddya know-little Fatima Pelosi. I bet the MSM doesn't touch this one. BTW - did her burqua fitting go well?

#23 Al on 2007-04-04 04:06 (Reply)

I just couldn't see Maggie Thatcher being this naive...she would be there to talk turkey to those guys and not make a spectacle of herself...how many leaders find it mandatory to go visit some guy's church on a serious diplomatic mission...ESPECIALLY WHEN THE BRITISH HOSTAGE FEMALE HAS BEEN HUMILIATED WITH THE SCARF THING...not a brain in Pelosi's head I'm afraid.

#24 realitybytes on 2007-04-04 05:08 (Reply)

Maybe her head got cold...after all, there isn't much mass on the inside to keep it warm...

#25 Gunga on 2007-04-04 07:18 (Reply)

"She can do anything she wants as a private citizen, but she is visiting a hostile nations as a representative of the US government, unfortunately."

Actually, both statements are false.

#26 Crimso on 2007-04-04 07:34 (Reply)

One of those Michael Dukakis in a tank or "Lieutenant Kerry reporting for duty" moments.

#27 Anonymous on 2007-04-04 07:58 (Reply)

So now Pelosi is "disgusting" and "subservant".
What does that make Laura Bush for wearing one at the al-Aqsa mosque in Jerusalem?:
http://thinkprogress.org/2007/04/04/pelosi-laura-bush-scarf/

Is there no end to the righties' hypocrisy?

#28 pete592 on 2007-04-04 09:09 (Reply)

I think the fact that Syria is an enemy of the US changes the whole dynamic of your argument.

#28.1 Tom Elia on 2007-04-04 13:47 (Reply)

I am not religious at all, but I take my baseball cap off when I visit a church. It is polite and respectful. Laura Bush wore a scarf in Jerusalem.

#29 Rob on 2007-04-04 09:12 (Reply)

Hey y'all they got us! There is a photo o f Lura Bush with one of those muslim scarfs!

#30 redneck on 2007-04-04 09:13 (Reply)

This picture disgusts me too

http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/uploads/2007/04/lauramosque2.JPG

#31 trippin on 2007-04-04 09:27 (Reply)

You guys are such a bunch of whining dumbasses. The first lady and secretary of state of this administration have both visited mosques and worn headscarves. Its a sign of respect of which it appears you guys are unaware of. 9/11 scared you guys so much you have become a bunch of screaming bedwetters with no sense of perspective.

#32 Drew on 2007-04-04 09:34 (Reply)

Funny, Laura Bush did the exact same thing.

#33 JeremyDeerifield on 2007-04-04 09:35 (Reply)

For those of you who don't get out much, consider this a public service:

Republican Reps. Aderholt and Wolf are currently visiting Syria. According to a congressional official on Rep. Robert Aderholt’s (R-AL) staff, Aderholt and Rep. Frank Wolf (R-VA) are currently visiting Israel and Syria.

Republican Rep. Hobson accompanying Pelosi on Syria visit. Speaker Pelosi will be traveling with a contingent of members of Congress to Syria. The delegation includes Rep. David Hobson (R-OH).

#34 trippin on 2007-04-04 09:41 (Reply)

Just in case you're relying on people like Limbaugh for your daily smears -- here's a coupls more who believe Bush is wholly incompetent at diplomacy. Ooopsie-- they're Republicans! Gasp!

According to a congressional official on Rep. Robert Aderholt’s (R-AL) staff, Aderholt and Rep. Frank Wolf (R-VA) are currently visiting Israel and Syria.

Speaker Pelosi will be traveling with a contingent of members of Congress to Syria. The delegation includes Rep. David Hobson (R-OH).

#35 trippin on 2007-04-04 09:43 (Reply)

Mr. Geary, you're usually pretty good, but in this case, ignoring the caption of the photo in the original article (that the picture was taken "inside the historic Ommayad Mosque") is engaging in pretty typical journalistic shenanigans.

From the above comments, a lot of people clearly took to your implication that she's walking around Syria like this.

Saying that it's "disgusting" and "subserviant" for someone to be respectful in a place of worship is what I'd expect from the people you usually make fun of.

#36 some girl from Chicago on 2007-04-04 09:44 (Reply)

Don't you think that appearing publicly in this manner in Syria, an enemy of the US, it what differentiates it from mere politeness, or respect?

#36.1 Tom Elia on 2007-04-04 14:16 (Reply)

Where was the photo of Laura Bush when she wore the Muslim scarf??? Your hackery is stale and America has seen threw your right wing hackery. The Pulosi attack is weak sauce. Laura wore the same scarf while visiting Muslims. Where were you then? You right eing flunkies can no longer get away with the hackery, America is smarter than you think we are. America is united against the radial right.

The pics of Laura are all over the net, with her wearing the scarf. Your tired trickery is the exat reason why your degenerate radical party lost in November. You show contempt for your readers, contempt for the base.
Also keep in mind 3 GOP cvongres members went to Syria too.

bu bu bu bu

at 30%
YOU ARE IRRELEVANT

#37 Jared (Homepage) on 2007-04-04 09:59 (Reply)

Another pathetic smear attempt.

Anyone that is still trying to push the neo-con agenda should really be ashamed of themselves. Too bad the only ones still foolish enough to buy into the neo-con-job lack any integrity.

30% and dropping. Time to f**k off now you right-wing losers.

#38 Bob on 2007-04-04 10:13 (Reply)

Once again the Repuglicans show their hypocricy - why no out cry for when LAURA BUSH wore her head scarf in the mosque? http://thinkprogress.org/2007/04/04/pelosi-laura-bush-scarf/

Typical. This silliness is why you're losing the hearts and minds of America. Republicans used to be better than this. I hope you become so again. You were once a great party.

#39 Tracy on 2007-04-04 10:18 (Reply)

LAURA BUSH WORE THE SAME THING WHEN SHE VISITED A MOSQUE

REPUBLICANS HAVE VISITED SYRIA

YOU'RE ALL RETARDED

#40 Dave on 2007-04-04 10:19 (Reply)

hey Dave Laura Bush doesn't hold herself up as the grandmother of feminism either, don't like seeing her in and am disgusted by the San Francisco Liberal hypocrite wearing it. I am very angry about the female british naval personnel being forced to wear it and it will be a cold day in hell before this American women ever wears the hated hijab.

#41 Rightmom on 2007-04-04 10:26 (Reply)

Ok, so you're saying its OK for Laura Bush, Karen Hughes and Condi Rice to wear scarves because they are not feminists. Uh, Ok. Then you say its not Ok for you yourself to wear a scarf, doesn't that make you a feminist?

Chew on that a little bit, I know you right wing nuts are a little slow. I'll check back in a week.

#41.1 coda on 2007-04-04 13:23 (Reply)

What a moronic post.

Here are some pictures of women in headscarves, from Jackie Kennedy to Laura Bush...

http://www.mahablog.com/2007/04/04/pelosi-wears-scarf-righties-bark-at-moon/

It should be noted, too, that many Moslem women (and some Christians, as well) cover their heads voluntarily. It's an outrage that some jurisdictions (like France and Holland) pass laws to force them to uncover, whether they want to or not.

No wonder the conservative movement is in such a nosedive, with geniuses like this blogger around...you pinheads need to learn a little more about the world outside your little pigeonhole.

#42 A Hermit on 2007-04-04 10:27 (Reply)

Wearing a scarf over her head in a mosque is showing respect for another country's religion.

Why aren't any of you uset and expressing outrage about the republicans that were in Syria right before Speaker Pelosi made her trip?

#43 IgnorangeIsNotBliss on 2007-04-04 10:28 (Reply)

When Laura Bush visited the al-Aqsa mosque in Jerusalem, she wore — you guessed it — a head scarf. She did the same at the Dome of the Rock mosque. Was she “donning the garb of America’s enemies”? Did she “disgust” the president’s allies?

When the First Lady visited the Vatican, she wore — wait for it — a head scarf. Apparently, it’s still required of women visitors to the Vatican. Is the right prepared to bash Roman Catholicism for having the same traditional rules as mosques in the Middle East?

For that matter, Pelosi’s own faith, Roman Catholicism, required women to wear veils in church until Vatican II — which took place when she was in her mid-twenties. And we have all seen photographs of Karen Hughes and Condi Rice with scarves wrapped around their heads hijab-style while visiting the Middle East.

You know, I really do have to congratulate you people for your ceaseless efforts to demonstrate every day how user-friendly computers are, that bipeds lacking frontal lobes and opposable thumbs (you) can use them.

Thank god we only have 22 months left till you screeching morons will be crawling back under your rocks.

Losers.

#44 TCinLA on 2007-04-04 10:31 (Reply)

This one too...

http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/uploads/2007/04/lauramosque2.JPG

#45 twf on 2007-04-04 10:35 (Reply)

Laura Bush wore a headscarf in the Middle East as well when she visited she visited al-Aqsa mosque in Jerusalem. Why do conservatives think that Americans need to just bust in like a bunch of out of control cowboys with guns blazzing? This country was built on a tradition of diplomacy and respect... Speaker Pelosi is a wonderful representative of that!

#46 Zork on 2007-04-04 10:36 (Reply)

Since you're all such strict "christians," perhaps you should open the good book and re-read:

1 Corinthians 11:5,6:

“But every woman that prayeth or prophesieth with her head uncovered dishonoureth her head: for that is even all one as if she were shaven.
For if the woman be not covered, let her also be shorn: but if it be a shame for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her be covered.”

#47 TCinLA on 2007-04-04 10:36 (Reply)

Normally, I try to stick to the "issues".
But, please, "bu bu bu"
You are shaming all of the rest of us who stutter.

"America has seen threw your right wing hackery".
I'll omit discussing your choice of "threw", other that to say I found 26 meanings at
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/threw
None seem to be even near "transparent", as in "see through" ?

"America is united against the radial right."
I can't figure out what you meant by "radial".
However, I do love "radial" engines as used in many of the WWII fighters and bombers.
The sound of power in our country that understood the need to fight Fascism of the German and Japanese variety.

Ms. Pelosis is just aiding and abetting one of the current versions of Fascism. Or did you not know the origins of "Ba'athists" ?
If you can't see THAT, well . . .

#48 Anonymous on 2007-04-04 10:44 (Reply)

Are these Republicans, in Syria with the help and blessing of the White House, "aiding and abetting one of the current versions of Fascism" too?

And yes, I do know the origin of the Baathists; I also know they got into power with American help because they were anti-Communist. Another example of why the "enemy of my enemy is my friend" theory of foreign policy needs to be thrown out...

#48.1 A Hermit on 2007-04-04 10:48 (Reply)

"Anyone that is still trying to push the neo-con agenda should really be ashamed of themselves. Too bad the only ones still foolish enough to buy into the neo-con-job lack any integrity."

The covered head business is the neo-lib agenda. I personally think the more of Ms. Pelosi you cover, the better.

#49 willis on 2007-04-04 10:47 (Reply)

oops, forgot the link:
http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/horsesmouth/2007/04/did_white_house.php

And though Bush administration officials have been criticizing Pelosi, it's not clear what role the White House and the U.S. Department of State played when U.S. Rep. Joe Pitts and two other Republican congressmen met with Syrian President Bassar Assad.

Pitts is a Chester County Republican who represents Lancaster County.

Gabe Neville, Pitts' chief of staff, said Monday the conference between Assad and the three Republicans was intended to be "low profile."

"It was done in cooperation with the administration," he said.

#50 A Hermit on 2007-04-04 10:51 (Reply)

Apparently they never saw Laura Bush when she visited al-Aqsa mosque in Jerusalem:

#51 Linda on 2007-04-04 10:53 (Reply)

Well she doesn't want to get killed.

You guys should read what the Muslims did to the Christians a few years ago in Lebanon. They gouged their eyes out, and cut the gentiles off and stuffed them their mouths.

They have been doing this for thousands of years! beheadings and much worse.

We need to drive feminism from our midst so our country doesn't becomen anymore of a Muslim statistic, just look at 9/11 and all of those people jumping off the building!

#52 Patriarch Verlch (Homepage) on 2007-04-04 11:15 (Reply)

And look at what Christians did to Muslims in Bosnia not so long ago...does the name "Srebrinica" ring any bells?

And WTF does this mean? "We need to drive feminism from our midst so our country doesn't becomen anymore of a Muslim statistic, just look at 9/11 and all of those people jumping off the building!"

Feminism is responsible for 9/11??!!?? We need to fight the Muslim by being as backward and bigoted as the Taliban and "driving feminism from our midst?"

The ignorance on display here is absolutely stunning...

#52.1 A Hermit on 2007-04-04 13:59 (Reply)

*"Are these Republicans, in Syria with the help and blessing of the White House, "aiding and abetting one of the current versions of Fascism" too?
YES !

#53 Dan Pursel on 2007-04-04 11:17 (Reply)

Ok, Dan, let's just be clear about this: You think the White House, by supporting a Republican led delegation to Syria, is "aiding and abetting one of the current versions of Fascism?"

You may be right, come to think of it. The Bushies did send Maher Arar off to Syria to be tortured, after all...

http://www.ararcommission.ca/eng/index.htm

#53.1 A Hermit on 2007-04-04 14:15 (Reply)

And Laura bush wore a black scarf when she visited the Al-Aqsar mosque in Jerusalem.

You are a moron.

#54 Devil's Advocate on 2007-04-04 11:34 (Reply)

#1 lesson in diplomacy: When in Rome, do as the Romans.

Of course, it is hard for ugly Anericans who know nothing about the world but their only backward one-horse towns to understand.

#55 Evil Progressive on 2007-04-04 11:38 (Reply)

Grasping for straws much?

It's different when LIBERALS wear the scarf, right? When Condi and Lady Laura wore it, it was totally different.

Diplomacy is sooooooo overrated. Let's just stand our ground or stay th4e course or something....because that seems to be working thus far.

#56 denise (Homepage) on 2007-04-04 11:40 (Reply)

You right-wingers are so stupid and so crassly ignorant that it boggles the mind.

When you visit another country, you respect the customs of that country. That is what polite and well-bred people do. That is what diplomats do. If you are not willing to do that, then don't go anywhere.

#57 Devil's Advocate on 2007-04-04 13:01 (Reply)

That code word "respect" again by an idiot leftist?

"respect" is something you earn.

Why should I respect a culture that treats women like a POS and the Koran infalliable word of god says to beat them if they disobey - and is accepted by millions of Muslims as true word of god?

Why should I respect a culture that says women are half a witness of a man, and receive half the inheritence of brothers?

Respect has to be earned. Nobody and no culture and no idea is entitled to respect until it can prove itself.

If you idiot leftists want to go in bed with Islamists against liberal values, then that is your choice. You just exposed yourself for the inhumane racists that you are.

#57.1 True Liberal on 2007-04-05 16:19 (Reply)

Hey Paul:

How come you do not say anything when my wife Laura or Condi wears one?

George

#58 George Brush on 2007-04-04 13:20 (Reply)

Funny that you would bring up someone respecting anothers beliefs, when visiting their house of worship. If I go to a Synagogue, I put on a yalmulka. It's called respect.

It's quite funny that you haven't ridiculed Mrs. Bush for doing exactly the same thing when she visited the Mid East.

Conservatives are quickly becoming so bereft of ideas or basic fairness, that I expect the last election look like a slight blip compared to the thumping you'll be receiving next year.

#59 Dick Tuck on 2007-04-04 13:33 (Reply)

These comments about "the customs of another country" are just a disheartening commentary on the state of liberal ideals.

The hijab is not a style. It is not a cheek-kiss or a toga. It is a recognition of the fact that women have physical properties that draw men into temptation. It as a ward against Eve and original sin. It is a mark of the subjugation of women.

It is possibly the most illiberal "custom" Pelsoi could observe short of having her genitals truncated.

#60 hitnrun (Homepage) on 2007-04-04 14:47 (Reply)

For many Muslims it's a voluntary demonstration of piety and modesty. Also for many Christians; Sikhs, Jews and some Hindu sects also prescribe head coverings for men or women or both. This is no big deal, really.

No question the Taliban and other fanatics take the idea to a loathsome extreme, but they are not, thankfully, representative of all Muslims everywhere.

On the other hand, I know women who have been forcibly escorted from a cathedral in Italy for wearing shorts, and had rocks thrown at them by Orthodox Jews in Jerusalem for walking near the Wailing Wall with shoulders uncovered. There are fanatics everywhere...

#60.1 A Hermit on 2007-04-04 15:44 (Reply)

One noteworthy thing about conservatives is that when they're not denouncing the left for being liberals, they're ostracizing Muslims for not being liberal.

Reactionary and utterly dishonest little degenerates, they have nothing to say worth listening to. They argue simply, reflexively, to argue...as if it is beyond their ability to not have an opinion about something they haven't considered.

#61 Phineas McArglebargle on 2007-04-04 14:57 (Reply)

Look at all these disgusting women!!!

#62 Dick Tuck on 2007-04-04 15:13 (Reply)

The multitude of ad hominem attacks aside (from both sides), it is a little astounding how some can continue to feign disgust for Pelosi's trip (and her decision to wear a headscarf) after reading post after post pointing out that there are Republicans that traveled with Pelosi, that a group of Republicans traveled to Syria just a few days before Pelosi, and that Laura Bush, Condi Rice, and other Republican women have worn similar head scarves when visiting similar places.

C'mon people...show a little integrity and intellectual honesty. What's the point of making an argument if you're simply plugging your ears and ignoring direct evidence of your own hypocrisy?

#63 Mentsmin on 2007-04-04 16:20 (Reply)

I wonder, is it really the same?

I mean, Speaker Pelosi is on this trip, ostensibly over a disagreement with Bush's policy toward an intransigent enemy who budges not one inch in any kind of 'negotiation' in an effort to show that she can talk to them, and she puts up with a custom designed to be degrading to women -- is that being hypocritical?

#63.1 Tom Elia on 2007-04-04 21:50 (Reply)

Hey, did you hear? Laura Bush and Condi Rice also wore scarves in similar situations.. I figured you heard, but I wanted to rub your face in your own hypocrisy... HAHAHA

#64 hahaha on 2007-04-04 21:20 (Reply)

If anyone goes to Yahoo news pictures and types in Pelosi Syria, you will see multiple pictures of Pelosi in Syria. When she is meeting with Syrian officials, she is NOT wearing a headscarf. She's wearing typical American clothing. When she is pictured touring through downtown Damascus, she is wearing a scarf around her neck(no doubt in preparation for her mosque visit), and typical American clothing. When she enters the mosque as part of her tour of Damascus, she wears the scarf on her head. This is simple courtesy to religious sensitivities in a house of worship. If there's a picture of her feet, it will probably show that she is without shoes in the mosque as well.

All this silly brouhaha really shows is how ignorant some people are of religious customs, even their own.

#65 zeezee on 2007-04-05 05:02 (Reply)

When in Rome do what the Romans do.

Too much excitement over nothing. Besides, don't you think Speaker Pelosi looks quite fetching wrapped in a beautiful silk (Hermes?)scarf? What did you ladies expect her to do? Go about in low-necked negligé or in mini-skirt perhaps?

Question of culture. You folks must remember that even in good ol' USA, any male person, even Dubya Bush is expected to and must wear a little teeny weeny hat to be admitted in a synagogue in NY.

So don't be too uptight about this. Just think, Mrs Pelosi is still one of the most POWERFUL PEOPLE in the world.

#66 Hillblogger3 (Homepage) on 2007-04-05 08:28 (Reply)

Any real liberal will take offense at the Pelosi picture submitting herself to a misogynistic illiberal culture.

So please, the term "liberal" should not be confused with leftists and postcolonials who find this picture oh so "authentic". Pls. use the term "leftist" instead of "liberal".

Any liberal who does not take offense from this picture is not a liberal. He is a leftist.

#67 True Liberal on 2007-04-05 15:46 (Reply)

I don't understand how this makes her less of a feminist. She is showing respect for this culture, and females who cover their heads should have the right to do so. We should respect them for what they believe and not try to push our standards on them. They should be able to be what/who they want to be and not conform to any male or WESTERN standards.

#68 Limon on 2007-04-07 16:43 (Reply)

Since we are listing things that are disgusting - Bible thumpers disgust me.

#69 lk on 2007-04-07 20:48 (Reply)

There is no reason why Pelosi should not be respectful to the another regions culture. Men and women everywhere have different clothing styles. If you don't believe me simply ask a man to wear womens underwear into a mens locker room and see how rigid American culture can be when it comes to gender required dressing.

#70 ruth on 2007-04-08 11:43 (Reply)

That code word "respect" again by an idiot leftist?

"respect" is something you earn.

Why should I respect a culture that treats women like a POS and the Koran infalliable word of god says to beat them if they disobey - and is accepted by millions of Muslims as true word of god?

Why should I respect a culture that says women are half a witness of a man, and receive half the inheritence of brothers?

Respect has to be earned. Nobody and no culture and no idea is entitled to respect until it can prove itself.

If you idiot leftists want to go in bed with Islamists against liberal values, then that is your choice. You just exposed yourself for the inhumane racists that you are.

#71 True Liberal on 2007-04-09 19:27 (Reply)

Tick.....
Tick....
Tick....

Not a sound from the reich wing about Laura Bush wearing a hijab in Saudi Arabia. What an insult to women of the world when the President's wife has to wear a black sheet when visiting the killers who attacked America on 9/11. DISGRACEFUL

#72 American Thinker on 2007-10-26 15:06 (Reply)

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